18:Turning Mourning into Acts of Kindness with Guest Michael Spehn

In this heartfelt episode of It’s Not Just a Tuesday, Andrea Walker-Leidy welcomes Michael Spehn to share his extraordinary journey through loss, faith, and resilience. From losing loved ones to founding the New Day Foundation for Families, Michael reflects on the power of generosity, faith, and the echoes of small kindnesses in transforming grief into purpose. Through his story of love, family, and service, Michael reminds us that life’s challenges can be an opportunity for growth, connection, and deeper meaning.

Key Takeaways:

• Generosity as Healing
• Faith and Resilience
• Love Expands, Not Divides
• The Echo of Small Kindnesses

How to Connect with Michael Spehn:

• Website: www.michael-spehn.com
• Social Media:
  • Facebook: facebook.com/michael.spehn
  • Instagram: @michaelspehn
  • LinkedIn: linkedin.com/in/michaelspehn
• Book: The Color of Rain – Available on Amazon and other major retailers.

Resources Mentioned:

1. The New Day Foundation for Families – Learn more about supporting families navigating cancer diagnoses. www.foundationforfamilies.org/
2. The Color of Rain – Michael and Gina’s bestselling memoir about loss, love, and blending families.

Transcript

Andrea Walker-Leidy (00:01.602)
Welcome back to It's Not Just a Tuesday, the podcast where we talk about work and life and the stories that connect all of us. I am thrilled to be here today with Michael Spehn, right? Spain, ugh. Okay, I've heard a lot of people say your name wrong then because that is a tricky one. yeah, that is funny. Yeah, it's the reason I hyphenated

Michael (00:15.957)
Spain, like the country.

Michael (00:22.709)
Yes, five little letters that have confounded a nation.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (00:30.936)
Walker and Lighty because Walker's very easy to figure out, Lighty not so much. But I'm here with Michael who has just got such a cool story to share and some new things that he's doing that I said you gotta come on and just share a little bit of that with at least the 20 people who might hear this podcast along the way. So thanks for being here with me today and I'm looking forward to our conversation.

Michael (00:34.143)
Yes.

Michael (00:59.051)
Thank you. it's a to be here.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (01:02.122)
Awesome. So I want to start by just letting you talk to me about just who you are, some of your journey. Catch us up a little bit on how you got to where you are. I know your story. I know a lot of other people know your story, but I think stories are always worth telling again. so share with us a little bit about just your journey and professional and just what

what makes you you.

Michael (01:31.915)
Sure. Well, like so many people, when you live long enough, you have a lot of things happen to you and you get the chance to see life from all new perspectives at different seasons. so I born and raised in Chicago and met my wife, Kathy.

In Chicago, we had three children. God blessed us with three beautiful, healthy children. then when she was just 37, I lost Kathy to cancer. So I was a single dad for a couple of years with three kids under the age of nine. And that, I didn't know what I didn't know. That was quite an experience, as you might imagine.

in so many different ways. then my path crossed with a woman named Gina who had just lost her husband to cancer as well. And we got our five kids together, formed a little Brady Bunch Rochester, Michigan version. And so we've been together now 17 years. We've raised our children together. When

We were really in the midst of grief together and beginning to sort of blend our families. were both people who have, who faith is a very important part of our lives. And so our faith was really calling us to turn some of our experience, some of our pain into purpose, so to speak. And we...

created a nonprofit charity called the New Day Foundation for Families. And this was designed to provide resources to families who were going to experience exactly what we had just. When someone gets a cancer diagnosis, it is earthquake to their families in so many different ways. And so we decided to try and bring hope to some of those families.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (03:38.54)
Yeah.

Michael (03:54.123)
quite honestly and sort of selfishly, that allowed us to channel some of our grief into more positive and more action-oriented generosity and really helped in our own healing. So that began in 2007, which was just a wonderful time to ask people for money. you remember, 2007 and eight,

Andrea Walker-Leidy (04:03.372)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (04:18.904)
That was a good time, yeah.

Michael (04:23.113)
Yeah, little did we know, but we've been blessed and God's provided for us each year. And so we started to grow that and we had some experiences in the early days of our foundation that really led us to believe that there was an opportunity for us to write down some of what we experienced, mostly for the sake of our own children who were very young, four years old, six years old.

when their parents passed away. And so we decided to write down some of our experiences, some of our thoughts. That ultimately found its way to a publisher, HarperCollins Zondervan. That became a New York Times bestselling book. And then ultimately that book was turned into a Hallmark motion picture. At the time, the highest rated Hallmark motion picture in history, which was kind of cool. All of that was

was particularly good because it really put a spotlight on the nonprofit that we had started and the work and the mission that we were doing there. And so that was able to grow nicely through some of those experiences. So that kind of propels us forward. Ultimately, my wife runs our foundation on a day-to-day basis and runs it.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (05:47.672)
I

Michael (05:49.951)
in a spectacular fashion. She is a rock star. There's no question about that. I have a day job, so to speak. My normal career is in finance. And so I help people grow and protect their own assets so that they can live generous lives in their own world. through it all, we, you know, the raising of five children is a unique experience. But

Andrea Walker-Leidy (05:50.264)
She's a rock star.

Michael (06:19.879)
Unfortunately, in 2015, our 14-year-old son Sam was diagnosed with brain cancer as well. He was given three to six months to live. And literally three days ago on Monday, he...

Andrea Walker-Leidy (06:31.564)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (06:38.849)
I saw that on Facebook.

Michael (06:40.969)
He marks nine years from his original diagnosis. He's been written up in medical journals as one of the 1 % that actually get to survive this sort of ordeal. And so we couldn't be more thankful to God for giving him that life and that opportunity. But through all of those experiences and many more, I've come to recognize that in my opinion,

First of all, I don't know how people navigate these waters because the life I've led, I've left obviously much and much out, but it's not unique. Everyone goes through hardships, challenges, loss. So I don't mean to say in any regard that what we've experienced, what I've gone through is unique in any way.

I have come to recognize, first of all, I don't know how people do it without faith in their lives. I'm baffled by that. And I'm thankful that my parents instilled in me early on a foundation of faith. then that was enhanced and further educated as I grew older by some very generous biblical scholars that I had a chance to spend time with.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (08:08.393)
Very cool.

Michael (08:08.691)
So that's been a blessing to me. But how that faith has manifested in the most positive ways is through acts of generosity. And those can come in tiny, small, sublime ways, or they can come in great grand gestures, right? Some people write millions of dollars in checks to endow their university. Some people travel to...

Andrea Walker-Leidy (08:18.924)
Mm-hmm.

Michael (08:35.855)
Africa to build wells, water wells for people. Some people are simply kind to the checkout person at the Kroger. Some people are kind and generous to their co-workers or to their neighbors or to their own family. Whatever path you're on, if you're on a path of generosity, it feeds the soul in ways that are incalculable.

I believe that the saving grace or the earthly manifestation of God's grace has come through acts of generosity. Generosity that I've been on the receiving end of and generosity that I've been able to express to others.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (09:18.508)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (09:22.04)
Yeah, that's so, it's that's so beautiful. And thank you for sharing so much of your story. I mean, I think you're right. You know, we all have our version of the things that we walk through in life. And it really always is, you know, I have a good friend and her and I always say grief, trauma. It's not a it's not a competition. Right. You know, and but in the same way, generosity, it's not a competition.

All of those things are big to you in that moment or small to you in that moment and impacts you in great ways. And it's that response, right? It's that way that we decide, okay, this is what has happened. This is where life is, good or bad. What's my job here? What do I do here? How do I make this?

Michael (10:12.917)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (10:17.108)
okay for me and okay for someone else and all of that. I think, you know, I've been able to kind of watch you all's journey. have some mutual friends and I think that it really is that perfect vision of, you know, my saying, life sucks, God's good, we're gonna be fine. You know, like that's it.

Michael (10:39.979)
Says it all right there says you'll need me to go on any further end of

Andrea Walker-Leidy (10:47.734)
Right? Because to me and whatever, know, to your point, I feel similar, right? I have a faith that grounds me when other things can't. And I know that other people have those things, right? And so I think it's so important to have faith in something. I feel lucky, like you do, that I have faith in something that is really good and bigger than me.

Michael (11:16.095)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (11:17.656)
and that I know in my heart will work for me in the end and carry me through.

Michael (11:25.289)
Yeah, and you said it the best. think it's grounding, it's foundational, it's literally biblical. You know, we are able to stand on the rock rather than on the sand, right? And so, for sure, it's not a competition, as you say. No one's loss is greater or less than anyone else's. I know people who've gone through divorces that are just...

Andrea Walker-Leidy (11:46.519)
Right.

Michael (11:51.659)
painful and horrific. I was a child of divorce. So I know a little bit about that. Or people who have lost children versus lost spouses or parents. There's no way to quantify it greater than or less than. And one of the smartest things anybody said, so when our book came out, we...

When you write a book, people tend to think that you have something to say now. And so they invite you to speak in a lot of places. You're still the same person before the book came out, but now they think, well, we've to have them come. Anyway, we've been invited to speak a lot of places. And somebody early on, as we were beginning to do that, they said to me, never underestimate the pain in the room. When you're speaking to large audiences or small, you have no idea what any of these people

Andrea Walker-Leidy (12:28.098)
We do have something to say.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (12:41.304)
Hmm.

Michael (12:48.115)
are going through or have just gone through. There may be people in the second row who just got a cancer diagnosis. There may be somebody in the back row who is in the midst of a painful divorce or a foreclosure or a bankruptcy or whatever it is. And so what they're trying to do for me was to put me in a mood of, first of all, you're not alone. You're not special, right? And second of all,

have grace for these people, have understanding for these people. I can't tell you the number of people, know, the other thing that people do when you write a book is they ask you for your, to sign it. And so people will line up and it's very lovely. Every single person that comes through lines to get books signed, every single one of them has a story and want to tell you, my brother-in-law this, my sister that.

And so, by the way, I'll offer you a little trick here. It's not a trick, but it's an act of kindness, I believe. One thing I learned early on, when someone shares something with you about somebody they've lost, ask them their name. Please tell me your brother's name. it was Jim. First of all, they desperately wanna say Jim's name out loud.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (14:09.207)
Yeah.

Michael (14:09.947)
They want to speak their names. Second of all, it just shows such care and love that tell me about Jim. Was he a music lover? Was he, did he love sports? Tell me something about your sister, your mother, and say their name out loud. And I can't tell you how it changes their whole day.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (14:29.856)
Wow, that yeah, that's so true because the memory gets to be there there, right? That person is there and that moment is a moment that they can bring them back into their story, right? That I think that's the biggest thing that we miss often is that person being in the story now. know, and so, yeah, yeah.

Michael (14:42.709)
Yep. Yeah.

Michael (14:51.901)
Right, right. make, keep them present tense. That was a very intentional thing that Gina, my wife and I did. She lost her husband, Matt. I lost my wife, Kathy. And especially in the early days when we blended our family and we all got under one roof, there are photos of both of them. There are home movies. They're, they're spoken about in pre- this, this is

Andrea Walker-Leidy (15:17.41)
beautiful.

Michael (15:20.363)
Kathy's favorite song, know, drops of Jupiter would come on and everybody was like, that's Kathy's favorite song. And so we were able to give permission to each other, not formally, just by living. I got to still be in love with Kathy and Gina got to still be in love with Matt. And that never changes. It's 17 years later and those things are still true. And those in themselves are acts of generosity.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (15:27.019)
I love that.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (15:50.412)
Yeah, well, and I think it is a really good reminder of just how big love is, right? You know, there's always that moment when you don't think you could love anymore. And, but when a one love doesn't change because new love comes, we just grow and we can expand.

Michael (15:57.471)
Yes.

Michael (16:08.235)
So we wrote in, I wrote in our book, The Color of Rain. So my wife, Kathy, had a saying, you grow a new heart. And what she meant was, you know, our daughter, our oldest daughter was born and then we had a second child. And you think you can't ever love anything more than you love your firstborn. Then you have a second child and you think, well, how's this gonna work?

Andrea Walker-Leidy (16:18.765)
Mm-hmm.

Michael (16:37.991)
Or in the case of like Gina and I, I loved Cathy, she was the love of my life. And then she died and a couple of years later, I now am marrying Gina. Well, how am I going, how in the world? Well, Cathy used to say, you grow a new heart and God fills that up with love for them. Love is not a zero sum game. If it's real, if it's godly love, it's ever expanding.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (16:56.205)
Yeah.

Michael (17:04.649)
And you don't have to steal love from this person in order to give it to this new person. And that's one of the discernments of is this real or is this sort of just infatuation? Is it expansive love? Is it connecting love? Does it grow your family and your friends and your world or does it steal from other people?

Andrea Walker-Leidy (17:15.554)
Yes.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (17:26.87)
Yeah, well, and I think, you now is such a great time in all of our lives, right? We've all had a year, right? Or maybe even had four years that feel like tough and a new, you know, a lot of new kinds of tough and some hard things that we really thought we wouldn't have to go through again collectively, even just as a country, right?

Michael (17:49.407)
Yeah. Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (17:52.032)
So I think those are the moments where you think man, I don't know if I can let somebody in I don't know if I can trust those people in our lives and and I I have seen that the people in my life that are That true love right my husband and others, right? Those are the folks that They help me grow my love grows because of them, right? That's the fruit piece of it, right? Like my I'm able to

Michael (18:19.775)
Yes.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (18:20.278)
do more because I'm empowered by their love growing for me. And I think that is exactly what you say about the generosity piece, right?

Michael (18:28.991)
Yeah, if love, if this relationship, and I don't care if it's a relationship with a job, a relationship with a romantic partner, a relationship with a country, does this relationship connect you to the things that are important to you? Does it connect you to your faith, your God? Does it connect you to your family better in new ways? Does it connect you to...

yourself and what you've always valued or does it in small ways erode and disconnect you from that? A lot of people get confused and they start to see that and they go, well, they're just taking me in a new direction. Well, that's fine if they're expanding your world, but if they're disconnecting you from yourself, from your values, from your God, from your family, then you might want to take a second look at that.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (19:01.95)
Mm-hmm. Yes.

Michael (19:25.983)
But when it comes to some of the fear, the anxiety that we have, whether it be on a macro level with politics or with community or whatever, the fears that come from pandemics and economics and other things, or whether it's just in small ways with work relationships or with sibling relationships, as we get to adulthood, people

struggle with how do I respond in a loving way, in a way that I want to respond, how do I respond to tension? How do I respond to fear, to anxiety? One of the

you know, weapons, if you will, one of the great tools that's a little more positive is our acts of generosity. You know, there's a million sayings, kill them with kindness and everything, they don't know, a lot of people don't know what to do with that. Okay, I'll be kind. Well, you can be kind verbally, you can be kind physically, you can be kind spiritually.

The Italians have a great saying that is one of my new favorites over the last couple of years, lecco di piccolo gentilezze, the echo of small kindnesses. And people hear small kindnesses, but I think the really critical part of the lecco di piccolo gentilezze is the lecco part, because it isn't just that your kindness is going to go out into the world, it's going to echo back to you.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (21:00.471)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (21:07.34)
going, yeah, that's so cool. That's amazing.

Michael (21:11.059)
Yeah, David McCullough once said, the great and curious truth of life is that selflessness is the greatest thing you can do for yourself. Because when we think about Simon Sinek has this thing about where if you go and drop in a quarter in the jar at the 7-Eleven, right? You don't tell anybody about that. You just do that and you move on. But if you spend a weekend building

Habitat for Humanity You're gonna you're gonna you're gonna tell somebody about that how you spent your weekend You're gonna because you're gonna feel so good about it You just feel and it's not a pride. It's it's a sense of I've been valued this weekend. I did something of value and I shared my personal value with these people and And we are fed. I mean we're designed by our creator

Andrea Walker-Leidy (22:02.328)
Right, right.

Michael (22:08.457)
with the so-called happy hormones, serotonin and dopamine and oxytocin, they flood our central nervous system when we do acts of kindness to others.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (22:19.126)
Yeah. Well, and I think that's, I mean, that's the whole reason that I wanted to do this, right? Is because, you know, I really do believe in the core of who I am, that the more we all just talk to each other, the better life will be. and so, you know, I, I think that's, mean, even looking at what you said about, know, what Simon Sinek said about the quarter or the habitat for humanity, you know, it's those kindnesses.

Michael (22:24.553)
Yes.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (22:47.712)
if we recognize the big and the small, right? If a quarter is all you have and you drop that in and you are allowed to celebrate it and you are allowed to share that as being a big moment for you, now, same as asking someone their name, right? Now you've got to let it be part of your story and you put it out into the world so that someone else will think about when they drop a quarter in the...

Michael (23:06.249)
Right.

Michael (23:12.799)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (23:13.408)
And wait, I've never even noticed that that bin was there for quarters, right? We elevate the opportunity to give and we elevate how to give and we elevate how to receive. It's so different than that I'm passionate about this.

Michael (23:18.185)
Right. Right.

Michael (23:27.787)
And that's a beautiful thing that you decide to do this to give forum to those thoughts and to those expressions, right? Whether they come from people like me or from anybody else you have in here, because there's a wonderful, there's a Psalm in the Christian Bible that is important to me, Psalm 30, and it was written by King David. And he had lived a very broken life and God had restored him time and time again. And he wrote, you've turned my morning into dancing.

You've removed my sackcloth of ashes and clothed me in joy so that my heart might sing your praises and not be silent. And when we all collectively decide to write books or to do podcasts or to accept invitations to come share our experiences in life through speeches, this is our way of, it's mine anyway, of not being silent.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (24:27.063)
Yes.

Michael (24:27.209)
because we have been blessed with, you know, we've been entrusted with challenges and we've been blessed with outcomes that afford us to live in this part of the world and be warm and safe. I've got a fire going here and right. So we've been, we've been challenged in life, but we've been entrusted with those challenges and

Andrea Walker-Leidy (24:34.326)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (24:45.801)
Beautiful, yeah.

Michael (24:54.439)
we've used the gifts that we've been entrusted with to overcome them and learn from them. And then it's up to us to not be silent and encourage one another to continue to be kind, to continue to be generous to one another in every way we can.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (25:09.272)
Yeah. Yeah. And you know, it's so much more than just, I we can, you know, we share our stories and we celebrate. I, I'm often trying to tell myself, remind myself of this, something that I learned along and I'm really honest about my mental health journey. And, my father passed when I was three and a half. And so we grew up in that. my mom never remarried, but you know, for

for kids and your kids have experienced this, right? You open up something that most people don't open up until much older, right? And so when I looked back and started to uncover what mental health looked like and we looked back over years of maybe needing some therapies and things like that and I had my faith, I realized I experienced grief so much younger.

Michael (25:42.613)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (26:04.588)
than we should. And I viewed life through that lens. Everything really kind of made me sad. And so I got into my 20s and experienced just a horrific depression. And what I learned was, morning will always come if you just wait it out. And so I think we forget that we can celebrate or even share our story before morning comes.

Michael (26:32.703)
Yeah. Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (26:34.432)
that we're all like, everyone loves a feel good story, right? Everyone loves the happy ending, but there are chunks of our lives that are happening before or after a happy ending. And I want people to be able to, it's not a competition. You can have good moments in bad moments. You can have bad moments in good moments. Like, but this is your life. You can sell it.

Michael (26:58.675)
Right. I will tell you, know, first of all, what was your dad's first name? Howard.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (27:04.15)
dad's name was Howard, everyone called, my mom met him as Tony. So a man of many names. I knew him as Tony, knowing my, I really had my most connection to him from his family. And so they all called him Howard. So I know him as Howard now because I never heard anyone say his name. And so when they tell stories, it's always Howard. So it's funny to put it together.

Michael (27:09.28)
Really?

Tony, is that how you know him today? Okay.

Michael (27:26.612)
Okay. Right.

Michael (27:33.087)
Yeah, no, I get it. But thank you for, I didn't know that part of your story. And it's funny, you use an expression that a lot of people use. They used it for my wife and I, happy ending. You guys got the happy ending, right? You met, you married and look now. But what we forget is that in my faith tradition, happy endings happen

in eternal life. As long as we're still drawing breath here, there's no ending and there's no happy. There's just, we're just taking care of each other. And that's evidenced by the fact that, you know, six years after I lost my, or I guess it was eight years after I lost my wife, now my son is diagnosed with cancer. You know, you think to yourself, didn't I pay that bill already spiritually? Didn't I already cover that?

Andrea Walker-Leidy (28:29.334)
Right. Yeah.

Michael (28:31.731)
No, you're gonna be revisited with that horror, right? And so, you know, and that goes back to the idea that, are you grateful? know, generosity is an act of gratefulness. It's an act of thankfulness, right? And people, I was married to Cathy for 13 years, knew her for about 15 years, married for 13, we had three children. And so,

Was it unfair? The concept of fairness comes up a lot. And so then you start tugging at that thread and the whole sweater comes off. So, yeah, well, it's worth mentioning though, because was it unfair that she died at 37 of, yes, it was completely unfair.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (29:16.472)
Don't tug that one. Don't just leave that one alone.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (29:26.84)
Of course. Yeah.

Michael (29:28.797)
It was also unfair that I got to spend 13 years waking up next to her. What did I do to deserve that? I mean, honestly, I thought, know, here's the most exceptional woman in the world and I get to spend every day with her. Certainly that's unfair. it fair that we were born in the Western hemisphere in the place that has all the food? No, it's not fair. So God's grace

Andrea Walker-Leidy (29:53.26)
Right.

Michael (29:56.869)
is an undeserved and unfair thing. Thank God. Right? And this is where we, you in truth, can you point, you know, we in this, in this war part of the world, we tend to equate fairness with good. Not, it's never fair that something bad happens. And when you think about that, that's really

Andrea Walker-Leidy (30:01.334)
Yeah. Yeah. Right? Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (30:17.293)
Mm-hmm.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (30:21.324)
Yeah, we forget.

Michael (30:25.475)
odd and kind of off. And so if you begin to have a different perspective, a lens of faith, a lens of eternity, you start to realize that these are all gifts.

Michael (30:41.291)
Cancer is evil.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (30:42.764)
Yeah.

Michael (30:44.245)
But God can redeem it. He can restore it. He can renew it. If you open your heart to Him and to what He and how He's gonna move in your life. If you remain closed, then that will be a difficult, that will be a more difficult life. But if you can remain open to the gifts that and grace that will come your way, then you can turn the experience of cancer into

Andrea Walker-Leidy (30:46.144)
Yeah. Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (30:52.118)
Yeah.

Michael (31:13.751)
gift. How? You can start a foundation that now serves 800 families every year and change their lives.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (31:20.46)
Yeah. Yeah. Well, and you, the fact that, first of all, thank you for sharing that, but also for allowing yourselves to turn that morning into dancing, right? Let it be a gift. think, I can't even remember, I can't even think of how many hundreds of families that you've helped, you know? And I've seen some of that journey.

But the part that stands out to me is that thought of the grace, it's always gonna be bigger than the fairness. There is no fair. I have a nine year old and so I'm in the very thick of life is kind of hard. Like he didn't realize that until now. And my husband and I were saying last night, some things happen in school now because he's in fourth grade and everybody has an opinion and.

All the boys on the soccer field know exactly the rules, all of them, and not all those rules are the same. And so he's, you know, he's had to navigate some things and he, you know, he got, he's, he's a sensitive kid. And so he comes home and he's hurt. And, and I say, you know, I said to my husband, said, I remember being nine and how much I had experienced by that, you know, how much trauma I had experienced. And I watched this guy and.

I'm like, my son, know, it's not fair to little me that I went through all that I went through. But my son just lucked out on two parents that love him. And he lives in this safe house. I created a job that was flexible so I could go to his field trips. you know I mean? Like, and he doesn't worry about food. He doesn't, you he said to me,

Michael (32:52.042)
Right.

Michael (33:07.551)
Right? Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (33:13.944)
The other day he was opening up his allergy medicine and he said mom this box says $34.99. Is that how much you paid at Rite Aid for my medicine? said, yeah, bud. Things cost a lot of money. He had no concept of how much that was and I loved that he noticed, right? It was like, okay, we're getting there. But that's not fair to him or to someone else and it was just, you

Michael (33:30.004)
Right.

Michael (33:33.631)
Yeah, starting to click in.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (33:41.324)
that those are those pieces, small or large, that I think it is a reminder that all of the good in our lives is evidence of grace. I don't, and that is the grace that I hope that I can give to the world around me.

Michael (33:51.904)
Yes.

Michael (33:59.039)
Yeah, and you can dial back the pedigree of everyone's life and choices. there are lot of people who sit back, again, in this part of the world who say, well, I earned everything I have, so therefore it's fair and I'm entitled to it and so forth. And you say, yes, you have worked hard. You've had the opportunity to work hard. First of all, you've had the health to work hard. You've had the brains to work hard.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (34:23.756)
Yep. Yep.

Michael (34:26.281)
And you've lived in a part of the world where working hard rewards you with exceptional wealth and opportunity. I think just simply being that it doesn't diminish the work. The work is impressive.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (34:31.788)
Yes.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (34:43.288)
There's still a lot that's outside of your control. Yes.

Michael (34:46.269)
Yes, there's a good amount that you were the recipient of before you ever arrived on this planet. So I think simply just being aware of those things, what that does is creates a little bit more humble spirit, number one, and also it hopefully will provide the soil for people to express their generosity to those

the least among us, so to speak. And by the way, the least among us doesn't always mean the same person all for the entire life. We all go through seasons of life where I am the least among us right now because I've just received a cancer diagnosis or because I've just been foreclosed on or I just lost my job or I suffered a, you I had a family member fall and break their leg and had to, couldn't,

Andrea Walker-Leidy (35:17.046)
Yes.

Michael (35:42.751)
weight bearer for three, four months had to rely on the kindness of other family members. So we all go through seasons of life where we need a little extra from each other. And if we're inclined to that, then we take care of, I want to, I forgot, cause that leads me to something. Margaret Mead was one of the great anthropologists, very famous author and anthropologist lived. And, and

They once asked her, you've studied civilizations and ancient ruins and everything your whole life. Tell us what have you found to be the first sign of a civilization? Like what is the thing that, and most people thought she was gonna say, well, certain tools or the existence of fire or whatever.

She didn't say that. She said without blinking. She said, when we see evidence of a person who had a broken femur and it healed.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (36:58.39)
Wow.

Michael (37:00.947)
And you go, what does that have to do with anything? In uncivilized nature, if you break your leg and can't move, you can't hunt, you can't gather, and you are now, you can't run away from predators. If you break a leg, you're done. Unless someone takes care of you. Someone protects you, someone brings you food.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (37:20.663)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (37:28.855)
Yeah.

Michael (37:30.921)
generosity, is human grace that is the first sign of civilization. And I just love that.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (37:34.423)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (37:40.392)
That's huge. mean, with thinking about what we know now and what we experience now where, you know, we call it a lot of different things, right? We call it equity now and we call it, you know, lifting each other up. There's lots of words that people like, yes, but that's civilization, right? Someone who needs something that I can do.

Michael (37:54.815)
Yes. Inclusion! Yes.

Michael (38:01.034)
Yes.

Michael (38:04.775)
Nothing could happen. Nothing could become organized or civilized on this planet until one person decided to take care of another.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (38:11.97)
Right.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (38:15.414)
Yeah. Isn't that just what Jesus did? That's everything. Yeah. Whatever faith you have. Yeah. The end. See, I said, sometimes we accidentally solve world problems while we chat. All right. So I am so glad I've not ever heard that. And that has changed.

Michael (38:20.469)
foundational to everything.

Now you can end the podcast forever. There, we just solved it.

I just thought that was magnificent when I first heard that.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (38:42.392)
that has changed my life. will be saying that to someone else probably before the end of the week because that is amazing. That is so true. Okay, so now's my favorite part of the podcast. I think you should have gotten a note about this ahead of now. I don't dance and if I do dance it's when we turn off the camera. But I call this podcast It's Not Just a Tuesday and really because I believe that

Michael (38:44.309)
Thank

Michael (38:57.941)
You're dancing?

Michael (39:03.582)
Okay.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (39:11.294)
Every day is not just that day. We're living our lives. We're celebrating something. We're in pain about something. We're experiencing life. And so I ask everyone who comes on to tell me last Tuesday, next Tuesday, what's on your calendar?

Michael (39:28.159)
Well, last Tuesday was election day.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (39:30.486)
Yes. I don't know when this podcast will come out, but last Tuesday was election day and I am thrilled. I'm thrilled that this is the question.

Michael (39:37.291)
So maybe, you know, maybe we... really? How many more hours do we have? Here's my thought on the election. I'm a student and lover of history. I'm not very smart about it, but I love it.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (39:43.416)
Yeah, whatever. Yeah, right. I mean, we just solved the world's problems. So I think we could talk a little bit.

Michael (40:05.483)
and I'm drawn to it and so I believe that it informs the present and allows us to grow and evolve and get better at this thing called life. Certainly when it comes to the country, we are an idea whose execution has never been better in the world than the 248 years that we've been doing it.

And, and, and, but we are, we are nothing without our institutions. The institutions of this country are, are vital. and whether you think they're in good shape or in bad shape, or they're serving our people, or they're robbing from our people or whatever it is, they're vital. They're, they, they must hold together, whatever your appeal is. My, I have five children, they're all grown now. They're all in their twenties.

And they know that dad is a junkie for politics and all things history. So when last week's election results were beginning to come in, I'm getting texts late at night from all my kids. my, of anyone's liking the outcome or not liking the outcome, because give or take, we're about split in this country, one way or the other.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (41:31.372)
We are.

Michael (41:33.511)
My ultimate response is I have faith in this Republic because our institutions have been challenged many times before, including in a civil war. And they have been stretched to their limits by all sorts of greed and corruption and nefarious wars and everything else.

So regardless of whether you love what's going on, what the results were or don't love what the results were, ultimately, I think that, you know, I have faith in our Republic. And mostly because the Republic is user dependent. It won't survive without the humanity and humility and what we just talked about.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (42:26.999)
Yeah.

Michael (42:30.417)
one person taking care of another. It won't survive without that. so ultimately I go to Dr. King's, you know, the arc of the moral universe is long, it bends towards justice. And so that bend might be greater or it might be less than, but it still bends towards justice in my opinion. so therefore that's

Andrea Walker-Leidy (42:44.002)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (42:48.696)
Yeah.

Michael (42:56.681)
That's how I spent my last Tuesday. Next Tuesday is Thanksgiving week and I cook for Thanksgiving for our family. Been doing it 35 years. I cook two turkeys, homemade stuffing, gravy, the works. And we'll have a house full again. We'll have 20 people. And it's my favorite. I like Thanksgiving more than Christmas now that I'm not a child anymore because

Andrea Walker-Leidy (43:06.616)
Awesome. Okay.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (43:12.429)
Love it.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (43:24.746)
Yeah.

Michael (43:26.667)
Thanksgiving comes, it's a great holiday, everybody gathers, there's no presents with a T, there's only presence with a C.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (43:37.526)
Yeah, Thanksgiving has always been my favorite holiday. Even I think even as a kid, just because you know, we didn't have a ton. And so Christmas was always going to be iffy, but Thanksgiving is going to be families all together and you're going to eat great food. And there's no pretense and you don't have to do anything. And so I've had my husband is one of eight kids. And so Thanksgiving for us is

about 37 and I've hosted the last couple of years. Everyone brings something, but I've hosted the last couple of years and my sister-in-law is doing it this year. But it's just the most amazing day because usually you don't have to share with too many in-laws. People don't travel as much on Thanksgiving. So where you are is where everybody's gonna come. So we have a really good time.

Michael (44:14.667)
That's crazy.

Michael (44:19.913)
Yeah.

Yeah.

One Thanksgiving thing that I kind of insisted on, cause I'm kind of a freak and I'm just gonna throw this out there because a lot of people have commented on it when we send out pictures of our Thanksgiving. I like everybody at the same table. Now 37 probably can't be done, but we usually have between 18 and 22, 23.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (44:43.01)
Yeah.

Michael (44:49.987)
And so I would each year, I would clear out our family room of the furniture and I would put one square table so that everybody can see each other. Most people have the long table and the people down here can never see the people down here. So it's one big square. And so if you have the room to make a big square table and let all your family, really.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (45:00.226)
Love that.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (45:08.674)
That's cool.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (45:13.932)
We used to be able to get at one long table, now I, know, I, both my sister-in-law and myself, we have, you know, dining room, family room together. So there are, you know, two or three eight foot tables all next to each other. We can usually get everybody in one room if we're It's just still impressive and just a visibility of, you know, we are blessed and we are grateful to have space to do that. So that's a perfect juxtaposition with between

Michael (45:23.562)
Yes.

Well, let's.

Michael (45:30.719)
Right. That's impressive.

Michael (45:37.311)
Yeah. Yep. Yep.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (45:43.744)
last Tuesday and next Tuesday.

Michael (45:45.555)
It is. We're all coming together in our favorite week, in our favorite time of the year and no pressure of anybody going, buying anything for each other. Let's just give thanks and just gorge ourselves on food.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (46:01.623)
Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (46:06.038)
Yeah, well, and I think definitely, you know, because we just talked about the election and I think your viewpoint is really great. I want to say this just so that I remember this. People will be spending holidays with people who come from all different spaces. And how important that we remember everything that you and I just talked about, that we are all figuring out our stories. We all have different places where we are in our journey. We all have

Michael (46:22.719)
Yes.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (46:35.852)
different shades of what we've seen as to be truth in our lives. And that's uncomfortable and that's scary. But if you like Turkey, we'll be fine. We can do that.

Michael (46:51.817)
Yes, all of that and Uncle Jim is an idiot. So other than that, no, I'm kidding. Everybody's got that one guy. And if you don't know who it is, it's you. No, that's exactly right. Nobody's ever changed anybody's mind about such things. So trying is a fool's errand.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (47:04.012)
Yeah. Yeah. Phew.

Michael (47:21.503)
better you slather some gravy on and take an extra piece of pie and just go around the table and remind each other that you're thankful that you're still there at the table because there's a lot of folks who are absent from that table and time is clicking and someday we'll all be absent from that table. So let's not spend it at each other's throats over things that

Andrea Walker-Leidy (47:28.791)
Yup.

Michael (47:50.759)
no one's going to move their opinion on anyway. Yeah.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (47:53.56)
It doesn't matter. I love it. Well, thank you so much for hanging out with me and sharing your story. I will put your information on this podcast. I know you do a lot of speaking engagements and like to share both your story and just these amazing insights on how people and humanity and leaders can.

work better together and see life a little differently maybe than we do. So I encourage anyone who is looking for just some inspiration to reach out to you and connect. All right.

Michael (48:27.947)
Thank you. Yeah, it was really great fun. Next time, maybe some refreshments you could have for me here.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (48:34.048)
Yeah, I mean, was BYO, BYO, I'm good. got a, you know, I have a soda right here. All right, let's.

Michael (48:38.347)
Yeah, well thank you though. I appreciate the time and always great fun to talk to you.

Andrea Walker-Leidy (48:45.4)
Great, all right, well everyone, this was It's Not Just a Tuesday. I will see you another Tuesday.